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Dragon Boat Canada


IDBF


Canoe Kayak Canada

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[paddleboy]

Paddleboy.....I thought you said you were a fast learner....and it took how many hits in the back of the head???? 2?

  Shrugging shoulders   DOH !!!! but it happened so fast.............LOL

[nakano]

Sure great to see how everyone is lovin those brand spanking new...(some cosmetic damages during shipping) Gemini boats   .  Yeah they are a little cramped compared to the 6-16's, and Buk boats.

I think if we actually had Buk boats, instead of the Gemini's people wouldn't be complaining as much.  The only thing you have to play around with in the Buk boats would be bracing.  Mind you when I raced in them a couple of years ago, we only had 9 seats.  The last seat in the boat which would have been seat 10 the person on the left would most likely making friends with the handle of the steering oar, or the steersperson.  As for the Gem's I would have to say though, 'seat 1' in the Gem's is not seat one, if you consider the drum sitting in the boat as well, good luck finding leg room.  

Hmm...I don't recall seeing many steers persons complaining about the Gem's!

All I can say is the more you practice in them, the more you will start enjoying paddling in them.    

Hmm...i wonder if people are going to be bitchin about the boats if they lose a race this year.

[butter]

guido...

mmm...MPF...now what on earth could that stand for?  If I ask him will he tell me?

Interesting to hear that the boats are designed with 11 benches.  I for one am looking forward to the challenge of adapting (again) to a new boat.  One more question though, and this may have to be answered by someone affiliated with Alcan officially.  If they are planning on alternating the heats between the Gems and the 6-16s, then how are they going to determine seeding in the final races and which teams will advance to Semis, etc.?  They won't be able to use times, because I'm certain that the Gemini heats will be faster than the 6-16 heats.  Just curious.

Good luck to all the ladies racing this weekend.   Wish I could be over watching, but I have to work.

later...

[Nook]

One more question though, and this may have to be answered by someone affiliated with Alcan officially.

I've got a roll of Alcan Aluminum foil so I'll answer your question for you.
Team advancements are based on placings, not times.



There's excess space between the last seat and the steer's platform.  They could have afforded to space out the seats a little towards the back, and move the foot rests forward just a bit.

[Imposter]

So, the obvious question is why the boats were not custom ordered with only 10 rows.  Didn't someone from Vancouver check out the boats personally prior to them being built?  How much more would the custom order have been?  For an investment that will last 10 years +, seems kind of short sighted, all to save a few thousand $'s.  

Having used the Buks, I can tell you they are far superior to these boats in terms of paddler comfort & space between paddlers.  I am sure they can also move alot faster, since paddlers are able to fully extend their reach and not be concerned with pounding the person's head sitting in front of them.  I can't imagine paddling in the boats with everyone wearing pfds...

[Nook]

Having used the Buks, I can tell you they are far superior to these boats in terms of paddler comfort & space between paddlers.

I've used BuK's too, and you're blowing things out of proportion.  Both Buks and Gemini's are nearly identical Sardine cans.  Sure there's a bit more space between seats, but not that much.  We already have the boats you refer to, they're called six-sixteens.  (On this note, I would like to say 6-16's rule, and Milleniums bite.)

How much more would the custom order have been? For an investment that will last 10 years +, seems kind of short sighted, all to save a few thousand $'s

It's a good thing to be able to run your spares in your boat during practices.  There was a time issue, to have these boats brought in time for the Festival, but I can't exactly say what that affected in their purchasing decisions.  

Someone took care of the scouting before purchasing the boats.  These boats are really nice, especially the head and tail pieces, you should see them.  Not like those stuffed animals they put on the Milleniums.

Also, Buks wouldn't last anywhere near as long as the Gemini's b/c our boats sit in the water for most of the year.  The only thing I liked about the Buk's were the nicely finished, wooden seats.  I'm also certain that in 6 or 7 years time, everyone would also enjoy the 'slivers in the bum' to no end.

I am sure they can also move alot faster, since paddlers are able to fully extend their reach and not be concerned with pounding the person's head sitting in front of them. I can't imagine paddling in the boats with everyone wearing pfds...

There's lots of room if you know how to make it, figure it out with your coach, what works best for your team.  You could always adopt the Eastern Lunge & Plunge technique.

This was the best thing they could have done, bringing in these Gemini's.  I'm sure a lot of teams will improve (maybe not in this festival, but next year for sure) b/c for those teams that figure it out, this boat practically forces you to paddle better.  Having said that, it will also cruelly punish those that can't figure it out.  Talk about fun!

[DBWTim]

Was browsing on the Eastern board and came across this... looks like someone over here used a GPS and found that the lighter Gemini's are currently running slower than the heavier 6-16's

The new gemini's are going to have a big effect on some teams outcomes ecspecially if you have never been in one prior.It is a real eyeopener useing this style boat as they are so cramped w/ 11 seats ( the BUK's are luxury compared to these).The bigger teams like Portland will more than likely suffer a little as a result .These boats are actually slower than the 6-16's and I bet we do not see anyone break the sub 2 minute mark in the Alcan .We have been useing GPS's on both the 6-16 and the gemini w/ the same crew and the gemini is definately alot slower .I think a fast comp A heat will be around the 2.05 mark ,thats it, where as the 6-16's could easily go into the 1.50's .The crew w/ the most time spent in the gemini's will probably fair alot better in the end .

and...

Now as for the Gemini's I can tell you we have done lots of comparision useing a GPS in a gemini then switch to the 6-16 and then back into the gemini w/ the same crew doing the pieces over and over within minutes of each other and then tried again on different days and the result was always the same ..................it's slightly slower ,take my word we are a fairly techincal team when it comes to doing a comparison. I guess we'll see after this weekend as the faster teams will be racing in the gemini's for 2 races each and 1 in the 6-16 .

[Optimal]

Chaos,

Do you have a link for the eastern board?

Thanks!

[Imposter]

Optimal, here you go:

http://www.geocities.com/dragon_boat_rankings/power.html

I agree with the posts above that the Gemini's would be slower than the 6-16s given the Gemini's space constraints.  We will see this weekend.

[paddleboy]

So they were right,  just look at Pacific Reach Echo's times


 6-16   -   2.06

 gemini - 2.13

 There you go ....slower boat

 It was an awesome day ..........thx Alpha for the good race in the final

[Optimal]

It sure seems that the gemini's are slower.

Since the gemini's are all new and assuming they are all equally as fast and we also assume the finals for ADBF will be in the gemini's. Then the racing will be FAIR and fun for all.  

[anthill]

Have been paddling in Geminis for the past few weeks.  Can't stand them.  It is unfair in this poll to lump them in with BUKs, or at least to lump the 10 and 11-bencher models together.

The Gemini boats at Vancouver are 11-benchers and feel like the middle seat in your Air Transat 747.  Back seat of a Yugo.  Clown car.  Painful to the extreme.   The foot braces are little lumps in the bottom of the boat (like the BUK) but thanks to the plastex construction technique there are exposed bench supports right opposite the foot bumps and in the perfect place to mangle your feet if you are wearing sandals.  Shins are gouged and dented on the bench in front of you.  Knuckles are scuffed.  Ponytails are torn out.  You get the picture.  No leg drive possible.

The BUKs I have paddled in from Great White North are a different story... 10 benches, so you are at least reasonably spaced apart, they have the same (or is it just similar?) hull shape and lift right out of the water when you get going.  Very fast boats.  The wake off the front becomes a huge problem at race pace, in swell it can surge up *over* the stroke seats.  Car wash level.   But man are they fast and a pleasure to paddle.

I understand BUKs come in 11-seater models in Europe too.  I can only speak of what i have seen.  At 6'4" I am on the upper edge of the size bracket.. imagine Kai Ikaika in one of those things though!

I voted for the Milenniums.  Simple, comfy, solid, stable, durable, good manufacturing tolerances (weight wise), reasonably fast.

[Swordfish]

Well, my team paddles out of Dragon Canoe Club so the first time we got to try out the Geminis were at the Regatta...thankfully we managed to get a practice in them yesterday. It definately takes getting used to, especially the leg brace, but in the end it was alright.  What I initially did was shove my outside (right) foot right up the gap in the seat in front but  what I found worked for me was bracing my right foot on the side of the plastic lump at the bottom so it shoved my right thigh right against the side of the gunnel.  I kept my left foot next to my right so that they kinda braced each other.  I found that way to help a lot with my leaning out and ahead. Dunno if that would work for others though...I'm not a tall guy (5'7") and sitting in the 5th seat.  It must be tough for tall guys in the back...

[BelligerentTuna]

I'm not a tall guy (5'7") and sitting in the 5th seat.  It must be tough for tall guys in the back...

yes, your teammates in the back of the boat were getting leg cramps... who exactly set the seating arrangements?

why that's YOU!  

[Swordfish]

I'm not a tall guy (5'7") and sitting in the 5th seat.  It must be tough for tall guys in the back...

yes, your teammates in the back of the boat were getting leg cramps... who exactly set the seating arrangements?

why that's YOU!  

If it was really up to me, I'd be breaking out the hacksaw...your lower extremities are just extra weight anyways...