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Dragon Boat Canada


IDBF


Canoe Kayak Canada

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[Guido]

Here are my predictions.......anyone care to share their own?

Premier Mixed:

1) FCRCC Mixed
2) Pacific Reach
3) Pari Huti (from Edmonton)
4) FCRCC Roli Open

Premier Women:

1) False Creek Open Women
2) Kelowna Women (not sure their name)

Premier Men:

1) FCRCC Men
2) Pacific Reach Men

Master Mixed:

1) FCRCC Roli Masters
2) Pacific Reack Master Mixed

I'd heard rumours Lil Boat that Could was going to go....but after that unofficial loss in Richmond.....1/2 the boat sunk.

[turtle_turtle]

I'd heard rumours Lil Boat that Could was going to go....but after that unofficial loss in Richmond.....1/2 the boat sunk.

Just curious, but please elaborate what you mean by "sunk".  And if Lil Boat goes, I see them in the top division as well.

And as for other predictions.......... I predict hot sunny weather in Calgary, cleaner water (instead of sludge), and fast teams in the top divisions  

[Diesel]

i'd say that the navy dragon anchors will do well....if the lil boat that could is going, they'd probably end up close to the top as well.

[Secret Weapon]

Don't forget that the Western race-offs and the Calgary Festival are separate from each other.  I'm guessing the Navy team is only in the Festival part but what about Lil Boat, are they trying to qualify for the WCC as well...Guido could you elaborate?  As for who is going to win the race-offs... it will be a nail bitter finish!

[tiger]

The lil boat that couldn't (in Richmond   ) is not in the race off.  Neither is the Navy so they must be in the festival part.  I think Guido is only talking about the race off for World Club Crew.

My thoughts on the race off teams:

Premier Open - FCRCC Men

I have heard that Pac Reach are running with 18 men and 2 women so I will give the nod to FCRCC Men.  Not that I am saying the women cannot beat some of the men but based on Alcan I will give it to FCRCC

Premier Mixed - FCRCC Mixed

Interesting division, 4 teams but only one can win.  I have heard FCRCC has picked up some strong women but lost some strong men (in Berlin, etc).  Pati Huti is an unknown for most of us but they have generally are not a top threat when racing against westcoast teams.  Roli appears to be coming together but I think they will come up a little short.  Pac Reach have been together for how many years?  I will give the nod to FCRCC Mixed just based on who they picked up (I hear that they picked up the paddlers all within the strict rules of club crew qualifying so nothing weird going on here).  Pac Reach will be a close second especially since they know the Dynasty boats.

Premier Women - FCRCC Women

I think Kelowna and FCRCC have raced against each other and FCRCC easily beat Kelowna so I will give the nod to FCRCC.

Master Mixed - FCRCC Roli (if in a tiebreaker)

This I think is the most unknown as both teams, FCRCC Roli and Pac Reach have not raced as masters teams.  We have seen both teams in bits and pieces but we haven't seen the teams race against each other or the other mixed teams.  I have heard Pac Reach did not have a full masters crew so they must have picked up some paddlers.  Roli has called on the masters of last year to complete their masters.  So who has geled as a team will dictate who wins.  I think this division will come down to a tiebreaker, one team will win the 250m and another wins the 500m so it goes to a tiebreaker.  If it goes to a tiebreaker I will give it to Roli since they are racing less than Pac Reach.

[magicpaddler]

You are correct the WCC regional are seperate from the regular festival.  The Navy team and a FCCRC team are registered in the regular festival part.

I see the festival being the Navy, FCCRC and the Calgary Canoe Club being the top 3 teams this year.

for the Regionals I see FCCRC and PR being the to 2 for sure with a slight edge in the heart dept going to PR.

[@1 with the blade]

Firstly, apologies for the rants and perhaps straying from the topic. Normally I’m not a writer; just an avid reader of the strings but to hear of more “pickups� from FCRCC for a Crew event gets the blood boiling. (looking at how long this has ending up being apparently it's been pent up for some time!)

give the nod to FCRCC Mixed just based on who they picked up (I hear that they picked up the paddlers all within the strict rules of club crew qualifying so nothing weird going on here).

I find it interesting that an explanation is included about how FCRCC picks up paddlers. Not to pick on your hearings Tiger, I just find it an ongoing annoyance that a Club founded nearly 20 years ago, with an advertised “home to over 1000 paddlersâ€� can not seem to maintain a consistant roster for a full season of racing. If not mistaken the Club Crew qualifiers allow a roster of 30 paddlers, even if team members may have other commitments does not proper planning take these possible vacancies into account? Yes, they may have technically stayed within the rules, but as a "Crew", fallen very short. I’ve wondered how smaller team/crews (22-26-30) can manage to field Club Crew teams while a Club with as large a membership as FCRCC can't keep seem to mantain a roster through two or three races let alone an entire season. Once again it seems that “based on who they picked upâ€� they may win. Disappointing FCRCC, a hollow victory if it plays out. As technically a member of FCRCC only by need of a boat to practice in it’s disappointing that they do not have a better system to bring up paddlers within their own population.  No one can deny they are a strong, dominant team but each time they win it seems to have a shadow cast over it. With rumors of last minute pick ups, out of town or out of club paddlers, jumped starts, miscounts of female paddlers, etc. If you've been around the sport for a while and asked a few questions you get to know who the players are. Ever see the picture of the FCRCC Men’s winning crew in the newspaper from Alcan 2005, how many Jericho crew members can you find? Infuriating, are they rostered for Calgary too?  Aren't they the team us up and coming Rec's are supposed to aspire to be? Not with their history, sorry. Is it poor planning, poor commitment or a consistent effort to push the boundaries of the rules? I really don't know, and may never get the honest answers... but muse this often.

Roli may have a slight edge in the Masters if the members they recovered from last year gel faster than the Pac Reach masters. I agree racing amount could be a factor but not too much of one. I’ve seen those Pac Reachers go from one race to another to another and be very strong. FCRCC took them by a couple seats at the Sea Festival event but only while PR was on their third race in a row! In another forum topic posted here I read they raced in Vernon in a final then a second race of stacked teams then proceeded to pull up a water skier! Wanting to hear more I called a friend in the OKanagan who happened to have caught the action first hand. She reported this was all done within roughly a half hour time span maybe a bit more including rigging the boat with a tow rope. To add to the impressiveness they didn’t just pull up a small kid but rather an adult female of a “not small stature�, definitely over a hundred pounds in her guess. She did mention the PR group never really had a serious contender in the final races so maybe they saved a bit.

Pacific Reach, have been around for 4 or 5 years or thereabout. A second team started and did well last season, and then seemed to have been incorporated to only one again this season. If the comments are true about PR running two women in the men’s division... full credit to them for sticking to their ranks! That's what committing to a crew membership is about. Win or loose they seem to be a strong cohesive team, I’ve admired them for that over the years. If heart plays a factor in the races, Pacific Reach has it won hands down!

Perhaps my views aren’t shared or recognized by others or perhaps I could be accused of being a fan of Pacific Reach. Maybe they are just more approachable to all us Rec’s and Novices as that is where they all came from. They and Roli, for simple matter of holding true to course, are respecting of praise as they both remain within their ranks and accept the outcomes. In a true TEAM sport and certainly within a CLUB CREW event I’d say it should be valued above all. Given a chance to paddle for PR, Roli or FCRCC (not that it will ever happen) I’d have a hard choice between PR or Roli. At least with them I’d have a chance to make a race rather than being sat out for someone that got recruited because they had a better paddling resume or time trial.

Always a fan of a good storyline, I already have friends and family set to give full reports on the events in Calgary. It should be quite the show(down). Wish I could attend!

Good luck to each of the teams heading to Calgary and further on to Toronto to represent the West!

[tiger]

@1,

I am one to be all for the club crew concept and protocol and I have to disagree with your rant on FCRCC Mixed.  They ran with 24 at Alcan so they are perfectly in their right to add the number of paddlers to the roster.  As it turns out, they have 4 paddlers not able to make it because some are in Berlin competing at Worlds (2 paddlers), weddings, etc (2 paddlers) so they are quite legit reasons and to be honest the 4 paddlers they lost are some of their strongest.  So for once I can honestly say that FCRCC Mixed have done a good job in keeping the same paddlers together, something that has not happened for a few years.  As for the paddlers they picked up, they come from FCRCC (i.e. they have been members of FCRCC for the last year).  So again nothing funny going on.  In addition, I heard that the various club crews got to see what roster changes each were doing and if they did not like then they could voice their opinion.  If this happened it almost makes it sportsman like, I think a group hug will be next   .

In the end, all of the teams going have been living up to the club crew protocol and that says something

MOOC (My Opinion Of Course)

[Secret Weapon]

Tiger can you confirm if there are some male paddlers now on FCRCC from GRPC's Gorging Dragons?  I believe they joined the crew a few weeks back.  They were seen doing time trials at Alder Bay.  I think this may be why some people "rant" on FCRCC.  I would consider that going outside their club.

[paddleboy]

Yes there some Gorging guys on the FCRCC mens team and 1 of them is on the Dragon Boat Canada comittee

[beedub]

Yes there some Gorging guys on the FCRCC mens team and 1 of them is on the Dragon Boat Canada comittee ......................talk about stepping over the line and possibly even going against the DBC rules .

 He wanted to be a part of this so bad and Gorging was not going to make a run for it again so he stepped over to FCRCC and yes he lives in Victoria .....hmmmm

hrmmm....interesting point.

[@1 with the blade]

I heard that the various club crews got to see what roster changes each were doing and if they did not like then they could voice their opinion.

After they voiced their opinion... they were going to do what? Change their ways immediately... given the history, unlikely. As you too mentioned it's been a few years since they kept the same paddlers together. You seem to have a good line on FCRCC information Tiger, again I don't mean to put you on the spot but what about the claim GRPC's paddler is rostered on their team now too. That's one heck of a commute to make all those practices for a year! Did the the various club crews voice their opinion to the GRPC member being included on FCRCC's roser when they all shared? Is he still on the roster and going? I missed the time trial others mention but pretty sure I would have recognized a Gorging Dragon in our midst for the last year. I've met a number of their team through the years and followed their run to the Club Crew Races in South Africa, April 2004. A handy guy to bring into a crew trying to go for a Club Crew qualifying as Gorging did the qualifying series last time maybe two years ago... hmmm in Calgary too... and against PR… Wow this gets better all the time!  That's one FCRCC membership form I'd like to see first hand. I am happy to hear there other selections were from seasoned members of FCRCC that have been members for the last year. Sorry I missed my chance to come out and play as I've only been a DB member for five!! Guess I missed that memo...

Those rosters offered to the other teams show the whole race season and include the Alcan Men's roster? That's one list of names I'd certainly like to get a chance to look over, all those FCRCC/Jericho dual club members. Was the Gorging guy on that one too?!  I understand that these men's races are more for fun than anything and a couple teams mearged to make teams. However, I go back to the fact that with over 1000 paddlers (at least 1/2 male) to choose from why does FCRCC go outside thier own Club for paddlers?

My opinion only and this may be because I don't have all the facts (but I sure would like to look at some membership records) I personally, still don't think FCRCC is honoring the CLUB CREW event and maintaining a true Crew roster. Tiger, your account of the numbers from Alcan mixed roster: 24 and after the 4 left for ligit reasons leaves 20 paddlers for the mixed event. Granted no spares but that is enough to fill a boat (maybe not if they only had eight females to start with -see planning-), that's the number they were left with after the others had more important things to go to. These smaller teams take that risk as they only have a limited amount to work with, period, and they manage.

I have heard that Pac Reach are running with 18 men and 2 women

THEY are working with what they have available! Others have even seen them race with only 18 paddlers and win (not in a final mind you). FCRCC may be within the rules, maybe the rules need to be stricter to ensure this stays a Club Crew event and not another National type -select-from-across-the-country-or-province-to-fill-your-boat- race off. Again I go back to the question of planning. FCRCC didn't know that these four paddlers were not going to be available for Calgary well before the race season started? Berlin's date just got announced, the weddings (theirs or someone elses?) were scheduled without knowledge of when the race off was... This was a surprise to them? Shoot, even the new one-year members they recruited had better planning skills than that! Here's a link they may want to check frequently http://www.dragonboatwest.net it may help.

ooop wait.......... Bubble.. bubble... bubble.... their goes the boiling point again...  have to stay away from this thing. I know why I stayed away from writing on these things. Just going to have to remember that fair play and ethics are only seen in movies, fairytales and storybooks not the real world. Just wishing that this has one of those storybook endings where the good guys win and not those that seem to manipulate the grey areas every step of the way. Going back to just reading...

I think this may be why some people "rant" on FCRCC.

Thanks Secret Weapon... no kidding!

[tiger]

Some rants gong on here but just in case you are wondering?

A club crew is up to 30 paddlers that want to paddle together for the year.  If there are not 30 paddlers you can add up to 4 people maximum as long as you do not go over 30 people.  This is how DBC and IDBF look at clubs.  There is no where in there that you have to be from the same canoe club or even the same city.  A paddler can paddle individual and then paddle with their DB team once a week, once every 2 weeks once a month or only at festivals.  Again, they are only going to paddle on one team.  

The GD paddlers that FCRCC picked up (only for the men's division, mixed is totally from FCRCC) did not paddle with GD this year so why are people lumping them with GD.  Have not all of you paddled on another team prior to going to your comp team.  

Paddleboy, you got in a nice rant with your former team but then you went to Pac Reach.  If your logic holds I don't think you should have been able to paddle with Pac Reach that first year since you were on another team last year.

Now is Pac Reach taking their Jericho paddlers with them?  If so then I don't think they are part of Pac Reach?  But in Alcan, Pac Reach had Jericho paddlers paddling with them.  So Paddleboy how could you possibly be on a team that brings on paddlers that have not come up through the ranks?  Doesn't that make you as bad as a compnay bringing in scap labour to get a job done.  I am going to call the paddler's union and we will start to picket the Pac Reach tent at the festivals  

So in the end, none of these teams are pure.  Based on everybody's rantings they are all cheaters.  We had better cancel the whole thing cause they all have paddlers that use to paddle on another team (oh no).  Or maybe some of the paddlers did not race Alcan so they can't belong on a team now.

You can all rant you want but in the end, the rules have been followed by all the teams that count.

Now let's get back to the predictions.

Out of here for now!

[DBWTim]

I guess I'll throw in my $0.02 while I take a break from the piles of work I should be doing (and I mean stuff I get paid for.. not stuff like updating the rankings/standings)

I think the main problem with the Club Crews is essentially the definition of what qualifies as a "club crew".  Correct me if I'm wrong but by definition the bare minimum of a club crew is a team that races in two DBC-sanctioned races (I believe that DBC dropped that down to one for this year) plus the Qualifier after those races. In all three of those races, the 30 roster, which is to be finalized by a certain date, must stay the same with an allowance of 4 changes to that roster. So in essence a total of 34 paddlers could have paddled for the team that season, but only 30 maximum on the roster (if I'm making sense).

I don't think it says anywhere that the paddlers must paddle in the same boat  or even in the same location (again, please correct me if I'm wrong as I've only skimmed through the handbook). Do I think this is what the Club Crews are supposed to be about? Definately not... but unfortunately, the rules in place have not reflected those concerns that have come up.  The Club Crews as they stand right now is basically open game for any crew that is not the National Team... as long as they uphold the minimum.

Also in regards to FCRCC... as strange as it sounds... but I think anyone that pretty much has that red plastic membership card is a member of the False Creek Racing Canoe Club, thereby qualifying them to be able to paddle on the FCRCC Club Crew teams. Sure, you will need to go through the selection process but everyone is eligible as long as they have membership to the club.

[tiger]

The only other to point to add is that one of the 4 additions must not have been on another club crew team in the same year.  That means if someone from Pac Reach raced in a sport crew race - mixed division (with Pac Reach) they cannot go join FCRCC Mixed in the same year.  They can only belong to one sport crew per year per division.

Just so everyone knows, I believe DBC is using Alcan this year as the west's qualifying race.  In the future I think some enterprising people will start putting on a sport crew racing series in the West.

We can hope  8)